Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

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Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

Postby crwheelr » Fri Jan 16, 2015 2:59 pm

POSPizza users,

I have been wondering why my credit card charge fees approach 3%, when I was expecting half of that when I opened my business.

Here's why. First Data DOES NOT STORE THE CVV DATA in there tokenized credit card reuse system. This has to do with the tokenized system where you are prompted at point of sale "Do you want to use credit card ending with XXXX?" If you answer YES the card is charged w/o CVV data. Its the omission of CVV data that is driving up the charge rates.

What we can do about it. It's against regs for the processor to store CVV, and we don't want to have to reenter all credit card info each time a sale is made as it is very time consuming.

I talked to First Data tech support and found out that first data CAN receive and process a tokenID + CVV number to process a transaction. But the problem here is that Chargeit Pro does not have this scripting available to query the cashier for ONLY FOR CVV when the Use same CC. We all need to be lobbying Chargeit Pro to get their development team to prioritize this effort. Basically the functionality is that when cashier answers yes to the reuse existing credit card? then a prompt for customer just to give the CVV number could complete the transaction. This will save you hundreds, possibly thousands $$ per month.

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Re: Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

Postby Hometown Pizzeria » Wed Apr 22, 2015 2:08 am

I agree with you and hope that maybe Scott can help us with this problem? Maybe a new item for the wish list would be nice for a update to help us save money. I am offering people a discount currently to pay by cash to lower my overall credit card costs.

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Re: Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

Postby Scott » Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:04 am

Hometown Pizzeria wrote:..maybe Scott can help us with this problem

Unfortunately, once the transaction is handed over to the processor, it is up to them to ask for any additional info that they may need. We can't collect any card data whatsoever, or the software will need annual PA-DSS certifications and updated ones each time a new release of the software is issued. This would simply not be sustainable at roughly $15,000 per certification. Our software prices would have to go up drastically in order to even consider such a thing.

I would ask the processor to include this feature. They could make it configurable to request the CV data when processing a previously tokenized transaction or to bypass it.


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Re: Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

Postby synpse » Wed Apr 22, 2015 3:16 pm

We use X-Charge, and got a rate reduction review (or whatever they call it)

we're down to about $0.08 per transaction fee. which is nice. And the "card not present" stuff we seem to be doing alright with having the slips signed, all the AVS address verification stuff.

this is just a quick note.. as I looked into Mercury and ChargeItPro recently for our 2nd location. Mercury just seems to be FULL of hidden fees, and all sales-pitch. We really do like the simple integrated processing.

Online Ordering (and paying online) is a whole nother ball game, for a different season, as we're just getting this going here FIRST. As MUCH as _I_ want to get the online stuff launched. They said "NO, NOT NOW". :)

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Re: Exessive credit card fees - we can fix it

Postby synpse » Thu May 19, 2016 1:14 am

UPDATE bump for this thread.

X-Charge went thru Accelerated Payments, now renamed to EdgePay. The rates were better with a lower per-swipe fee rather than a lower transaction percent fee. ChargeItPro and Mercury seemed to have gone that route. With our average ticket about $30, we save with lower per-swipe. But, with all the DAMN FEES, our overall monthly processing fees are jumping to 3.17%

So, I've taken the time recently, since the 6.93 Update was released, to evaluate the NEW payment processor options.

I've spent some time over the past few weeks speaking with Charles from Heartland Payments. He is another Pennsylvania local, raising his family in the same state I am. I'm happy to keep my business in-state, ever since my toy factory was closed, and now Wooly Willy is MADE IN CHINA. (http://www.amazon.com/Smethport-Wooly-W ... B00BT92SB0) (I dislike Patch Products of Beloit, WI)

We are switching over to Heartland Payments. Yes, we have to buy the $260 PAX S300 EMV/PIN terminal. The company pushes for transparency in the credit card industry. They charge a very 'competitive' trans fee & per swipe fee. At least two tenths of a percent lower. That's 0.2% lower, and $0.02 per swipe lower. Also, we will be running debit cards as DEBIT, with PIN, which will get us into the "Durbin Reg" rate of 0.005% + $0.22, plus "padding". Processing this way is a LOT BETTER than running someone's debit card as a credit card, and paying the 1.8%+0.08 per swipe, plus "padding" of 0.8% YES IT'S REAL MONEY SAVED! Just in "How" we do it. At this point, I really do NOT care if X-Charge/EdgePay says they can "match a competitor's offer!" They can take their shady fee structures and be gone. Same with ChargeItPro and Mercury, even though I never gave Mercury much of a chance.

Also, if you are a "Restaurant" versus a "Pizza Shop", you could save additional % + $ by making sure your business is categorized in the correct "INDUSTRY" with your payment processor.

Right now, there is a HUGE CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT against VISA & MC for anti-trust "Price Fixing" the interchange rates. The lawsuit is in Appeals, and THIS is part of what that Walmart "Trending News" on Facebook was partly about. So, If you accepted credit cards between something like 2008 and 2012, you could get 1% of 8 months transactions back. Check out the official website for the exact details. http://www.paymentcardsettlement.com

Anyways, the Chip Cards (called EMV) went into effect Oct 2015. We are a little bit behind, but Scott has put some amazing work into dealing with the PCI Compliance certification for his software. That is a task I'm not envious of having to complete myself. Big THUMBS UP to Scott for doing what's best for us, the little guys.

For the sake of business sanity, we decided to go with an Integrated solution. At this point, there are now better integrated solutions for POS Pizza.

Also, we do the CVV (3 digit security code), AVS, and AVS2 for our orders. Especially Delivery Orders! With the manually keyed card entries, your processing percent jumps up about 1% auto-magically. If we can reduce that to 0.4%, then we save that 0.6% on deliveries. AVS is Address Verification System, such as the "Billing Zipcode" for AVS, and the whole street address for AVS2. (I think, it's late at night right now). Some places value speed & convenience of NOT asking "..and your billing zipcode?" and are fine with paying extra. We are a small business, and would rather NOT pay extra. If your database and Customer Accounts are properly entered, POS Pizza will pull this address information into X-Charge auto-magically, so there is not much worry. If it's correct, you'll get the discount, if not, meh, it's easy to skip over and not notice when it says "Billing Zip MATCH, Address FAIL" on the "APPROVED" message.

The biggest way to get ChargeItPro's attention is with YOUR money. I suggest checking out the new alternatives, and get a better processor if necessary.

Hometown Pizzeria, (Sorry I don't know your name)
Yes, a "Cash Discount" is the legal way to say "pay by credit card fee". Losing 3% is NOT fun. Neither is 2%. But then, the more convenient it is for customers to buy, the more they will buy. POS Pizza's Coupon system is excellent for a quick % Discount. I despise "Sales & Marketing" as a "College Degree" and also as a "Cost of Doing Business" when it comes to shady practices and blatantly screwing their "customers" thru smoke & mirrors billing systems & fees.

Welp, That's about all I have to say about that. We will see how the new PAX Terminals work, and how customers respond. Sorry to bump this year old thread, but it's the best place to drop all this information.


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